Episode 154 - How to curate a great birth
Mel:
[0:00] Welcome to the Great Birth Rebellion podcast. I'm your host, Dr. Melanie Jackson. I'm a clinical and research midwife with my PhD, and each episode, I cast a critical eye over current maternity care practice by grappling with research and historical knowledge to help you get the best out of your pregnancy, birth, and postpartum journey.
Mel:
[0:25] Welcome to today's episode of the Great Birth Rebellion podcast. Today I've invited Alice Blyeathman to the podcast. She describes her no regrets birth and we talk about what women can do to curate a great birth experience for themselves. For sure there are uncontrollable elements to pregnancy, labor and birth. Things that nobody can change. But there are some things that you can do, things that are within your reach that can positively influence your birth experience. There is no denying that you can't control everything, but you are in a position to influence a lot of things. And we highlight some of those today through Alice's story. For some of you listening, you might be surprised to hear that there are some things that are within your power to change and influence what happens to you while you're giving birth, because we're always told that this is an uncontrollable event and this is great news because this means that there are so many elements of your birth that don't need to be left to chance you don't have to go with the flow and hope for the best there are things that you can do to influence the events of your birth and Alice's birth gives an example of this and it also highlights some of the things that you can do for yourself.
Mel:
[1:46] Now, for a long time, I resisted adding birth stories to the podcast program because there are already so many great podcasts that are sharing birth stories. But I do think we can learn from birth stories. So we started adding the occasional birth story into the roster of the Great Birth Rebellion podcast. You know, we shared our first birth story with Renee Barge, who had a hospital and home birth, and that was a few episodes ago. And if you heard her story, you'll know that we're actually sharing birth stories a little bit differently on The Great Birth Rebellion. What you'll see is there are some embedded lessons that you can take away that
Mel:
[2:27] I've added in in post-production. So my own little bits of commentary and little mini lessons as we go. And as you listen to Alice's story, you'll hear a little sound effect that goes like this. And this tells you that I'm about to interrupt the story and add a little something so let's get started welcome Alice to the Great Birth Rebellion podcast thanks.
Alice:
[2:51] Mel for having me we were just talking off air how honored I am to talk because I feel like this podcast was was one of the reasons why I had such a positive birth experience and went into birth so educated empowered so I'm so happy to talk and hopefully share some you know element of enthusiasm or motivation or positive experience with my experience birth and labor and postpartum all that fun stuff
Mel:
[3:15] And that's why I invited you onto the podcast because I knew you were listening through your pregnancy and and I you know you were posting every now and then about what you'd learned from the podcast and then when I saw you had your baby I was like oh okay she's had the baby and then recently you shared your birth story because it's a great story you know your first baby so for people listening who might not know you, Can you introduce yourself? Who are you? What do you do today? And then we're going to jump into your birth story.
Alice:
[3:46] Yes. Okay. Well, at the moment, my days are filled with breastfeeding and that's about it. I have a little five-week-old Tide who is just the light of my life at the moment. But before Tide, I practice largely as a dietician online. I buy my own business online. So that's, yeah, that's a large part of my, I guess, sort of professional identity. And I also do some social media work on the side yeah I guess like that's me from a professional sense I just find it hard to describe myself and then sort of personally uh I just I guess now I'm a mom before that I traveled Australia in my van so some people might know me from that season of my life but yeah I think you know deep down I'm just somebody who's very very curious and when I became pregnant I wanted to have a really good experience with birth and pregnancy and And I'm not someone who just goes, oh, yeah, like, I'll just figure it out. Like, it'll just happen. You know, I'm a bit of a nerd academically. So I feel like maybe you're similar, Mel, like, you know, just sort of accept things for what they are. So I was very, very, very curious. And that's sort of what led me to finding the podcast and, you know, midwives and things suggested, of course, and looking into things further than what they may have here.
Mel:
[4:59] Well, I mean, it sounds like you just wanted to make informed decisions.
Alice:
[5:03] Which... Pretty much, yeah.
Mel:
[5:04] The brand that you live your life by.
Alice:
[5:07] That's right. Yeah. And, you know, I'm not somebody who is – as a dietitian, you get taught looking at research and analysing things and interpreting things and not taking things as face value. And I think that that's really kind of foregrounded my experience in pregnancy and labour and birth and postpartum. So, you know, I'm not here being like anti this, anti that. I'm just there, okay, what information do we have and what can I take and what can I leave and how can I give myself the best possible situation, kind of let other things go that might happen that, you know, I didn't necessarily support. But, yeah, it's a good position to be in, empowered and educated.
Mel:
[5:51] You know, when you shared your story publicly online, You talked about it being a really positive experience. So for people listening, I just need you to know that this is a really positive story. Some people, they don't want to go into it not knowing what they're in for.
Alice:
[6:09] I find myself actually kind of holding back sometimes sharing it. And I did so on social media. I was like, do I share this? Do I not? Like how much of it do I share? And I kind of came to the conclusion that like everyone has their own experiences and And I can't hold back mine based off sort of, you know, other people's experience. And that's not to say that I'm being sort of invalidating or anything, but I think it's really nice to hear a whole plethora and colour of different people's experiences with labour, birth, pregnancy. And so, you know, we know what we can have and what we can go into and what we even, you know, can pay for, but not in a way that we go, okay, that's the gold standard and you're the best person and, you know, you win. Because there's an element of luck that's involved as well. So, yeah, I want to say that as well. I don't want to come across and be like, I'm the best. I had the best healthy birth and everyone should aim for my kind of birth because it's not always possible either.
Mel:
[7:08] And that's it. I mean, this podcast is all about sending the message that birth can be great because society tells us that birth is dangerous and scary and painful and something that you have to endure. And so that's the prevailing message. So we are trying to just change the discourse a little bit. Like, no, actually, birth can be amazing. It's okay to have an expectation that that could happen. And you got there. You know, I do think there's some planning and strategy involved with that. And I think we'll hear through your story that there were particular choices that you made that.
Mel:
[7:47] Increased the chance of you having.
Alice:
[7:50] A positive
Mel:
[7:51] Experience so we're going to go into your story I'm keen to hear all about it you know if you're listening you might find that there are little decision points here that actually did impact the ultimate outcome of your birth.
Alice:
[8:04] You know to start off with TJ my partner and I decided to like go and apply for the mid-bifery group which is in Australia and some states you can essentially apply for it to the public system you get given a midwife through the duration of your pregnancy and six weeks or so postpartum and that for me was really important knowing I guess the continuality of care is really important in successful outcomes and I just kind of knew that.
Mel:
[8:30] Now what Alice is talking about here is midwifery group practice programs they're often made available through hospitals particularly here in Australia and other places around the world, they have midwifery group practice and continuity of care with your own midwife. And in some places like New Zealand and in the UK, this can be commonplace and embedded in the healthcare system. It's not exactly like that here in Australia and definitely not in the US. And I know I'm listening to you out there, UK midwives who are saying, oh my gosh, our system used to be so perfect. Well, not every system's perfect, but it used to be so good. And I know that in the UK, there's a huge blow up around the maternity care system at the moment. But continuity of midwifery care is considered gold standard. If you have a look at which midwifery models of care or which maternity models of care seem to be the most satisfactory to women, it's continuity of midwifery care. And there's a few things here, particularly in depending on where you are it'll be different here in Australia a maximum of about 30% of women have access to some kind of continuity of care.
Mel:
[9:45] But be cautious with that stat. I know you're thinking, well, that's great, one in three women. Not really. There are some models that are full continuity, so pregnancy, birth, and postpartum, where women can access that. But hospitals are starting to introduce these programs that only have antenatal, postnatal care, and you don't have the same midwife with you for birth. And that is included in the continuity of care data. So I don't think as many women are getting access to continuity of care as being advertised, but there you go also it depends on where you live so you might not have access to this midwifery group practice programs as part of a public hospital system so it's important to find out what you have access to with the services that are around you so continuity of midwifery care programs are not always the most accessible option for lots of women a lot of women just have to make do with what we call fragmented care where they'll go into hospital and they just get given whoever is on shift that day. So just know that you can have a look at hospitals and their services in the area to see if anyone provides midwifery group practice or continuity of care models and it's important to do this early because they are quite popular and they book up.
Mel:
[11:02] The other aspect that impacts your access is your risk status. And I hate using that phrase, but often to access continuity of care programs, they have a system where you could be risked out of the program because of particular risk factors. There are some all risk midwifery continuity of care models, but they're again, a lot more rare.
Mel:
[11:25] So what Alice is talking about here is that she managed to access a publicly funded one and it also happened to have a birth center so she had her own midwife and she didn't have to give birth at the hospital and here in Australia that's on Medicare it didn't cost her anything she did remain low risk through her pregnancy so she was able to stay on the MGP program so without a doubt midwifery continuity of care programs would be my very top tip if you want to apply any elements of to your pregnancy and birth that are going to increase a chance of you feeling like your birth was great and experiencing a great birth this would be my top recommendation so some women will be able to have continuity of care with an obstetrician for example or a private midwife and obstetricians are particularly good if you have a complex pregnancy and you want to have the same care provider care for you for your entire pregnancy. Certainly an obstetrician is an option. Also private midwifery is an option. The downside of private continuity of care models though is that they obviously have some out-of-pocket cussed. There's a little bit of a Medicare gap but overall here what I want to endorse is this idea that continuity of care is one of the key elements of, in order for you to also curate a great birth for yourself?
Alice:
[12:50] You know, it's pretty obvious. Like if you have the same person throughout your whole pregnancy and postpartum experience, you're probably going to have a better experience. So that was something that was really important to me. And I guess that was one of the decisions that I feel like had led me to look into things a little bit deeper and to start investigating and looking into different types of births and all those experiences is because the midwife I had kind of understood me and understood the way they think and feel and what sort of birth I wanted to have. And because of that continuality of care, she was able to kind of back me the whole way. So definitely that was one of the first things. So we basically had a really smooth pregnancy. The whole pregnancy, there was no real mishaps. We did a few scans and we decided against some things. And based off the past largely and my other research. But it was a pretty chill pregnancy. Like I actually had really bad morning sickness the whole time, but outside of my life, it was fine.
Alice:
[13:54] During the pregnancy, I had acupuncture done every fortnight and basically just turned active the whole pregnancy. And I think for me, outside of just mental health, it kind of made sense. And I guess that sort of foreshadows a lot of my entire pregnancy and postpartum and labor is like things I just did things that made sense you know and and what I mean by that is like moving my body doing some pilates not being too mean to myself that kind of made sense and it felt right and you know I think we have these instincts as females to to sort of protect our bodies and and as females during pregnancy in particular and I think sometimes because of particular social media or or the medicalization spectrum we kind of just forget but we we can listen to our bodies so a
Mel:
[14:46] Lot of the.
Alice:
[14:46] The whole process of that pregnancy was kind of in a sense inadvertently preparing myself for labor but i didn't do it on purpose i just did it because it felt right so acupuncture meditation stretching pelvic floor stuff you know relaxing pelvic floor in particular, that third trimester,
Alice:
[15:06] Honestly, educating myself, that was pretty much the crux of it. It was just educating myself and building the confidence that, hey, even though maybe historically you've been led to believe that labor and birth is scary or it's dangerous, that doesn't need to be the narrative that you need to live out. And you can actually rewrite that and you can do that through education, surround yourself with the right people. So education being reading books or listening to podcasts like The Great Birth Rebellion or even talking to your midwives or people who have had positive experiences. And even if people haven't had those positive experiences in birth, people who have a really positive mindset around it, I think it's very easy to have an experience and still, you know, where people kind of look at it and go, you know, it was hard or it was terrible or it was bad. But you know you can do it it's fine like it's okay um and then there's the flip side where it's hard and bad and scary and so being quite selective with the conversations I had around birth and pregnancy and labor was really important to me you
Mel:
[16:17] Know you mentioned before we started recording that your midwives really encouraged this kind of activity this encouraged you to get informed.
Alice:
[16:27] 100% I think one of the things that encourage me more is they never they never push things on me they always ask and I think it's such a small thing that maybe I'm just quite you know sensitive in that I notice it but it's like what would you like to do rather than let's just do this or you know that's what we do you know it's like oh I get a choice in this matter oh I need to understand it then. And it's a really good thing because it means that you actually look into the options rather than just being told, this is what we do.
Mel:
[17:02] Well, this is the difference that I notice with continuity of care midwifery. And midwives who choose to work in those models are usually very interested in what? That women who they're looking after want to do. They want to give, you know, we call it woman-centered care because it literally focuses on what do you want to do? And I love that you mentioned, you know, when you get asked what do you want to do, you're almost obliged to go away and find out what the options. Yeah. And I've got to choose something. And you mentioned to me earlier too that your midwives recommended the podcast as a potential resource to discover information.
Alice:
[17:46] You know, them giving me the option to find out myself. And, you know, I can understand that not everyone has, say, medical history, medical sort of based education, sorry. And maybe sometimes it can be really hard to decipher information like that. But, you know, even giving the client or the patient the possibility of choice, I think so so powerful it kind of it really inspired me and empowered me and educated me throughout the whole
Mel:
[18:15] Process so it sounds like ben your pregnancy was fairly uneventful in the grand scheme of things and yeah obviously you managed to stay on the midwifery program which means nothing major came up now the reason i mentioned this here about the inclusion criteria for midwifery continuity of care programs is you have to know that just because you get on one doesn't mean you're going to stay on one if you do manage to have or find a midwifery group practice in your area that you have access to just ask them some questions about the inclusion criteria who's allowed in who's not and if they are a no exit program so some programs are no exit so it doesn't matter what complications you develop through your pregnancy or if you decline any tests because that's another reason that they might not let you stay on the program if you decline for example group b strep testing or diabetes testing or any ultrasounds then sometimes they just say well you can't be on the program so do quiz them a little bit about their inclusion criteria and what criteria means you'd be no longer eligible for the program Alice was really fortunate to stay on there.
Mel:
[19:29] But this is certainly something that can trip women up and what they find is that they get on the program and then they find themselves back into standard care not realizing that there were criteria by which they needed to fulfill to stay on the program if you don't want that hung over you don't want that uncertainty as part of your birth planning the real only way to avoid that is to be in a no exit program or hire a private clinician so a private obstetrician or private midwife for continuity of care or both. And that you're much less likely to not have access to that. Usually those two programs, those two strategies will mean that you'll have that same midwife or same obstetrician that you planned to have.
Mel:
[20:18] So talk us through your birth. Do you feel like you're ready to go there?
Alice:
[20:23] Oh, yeah. I'm so ready. So it's funny, actually. so with my birth I always had this feeling that I was going to give birth early and when I say early I'm talking like pre sort of 39 weeks and I don't know why I was just like I'm just gonna give birth early that's just what I'm gonna do and at 37 weeks I remember waking up and now mind you this is the first birth I've had so I don't know what it feels like to give birth I woke up at 37 weeks and I was like the baby's really low like I feel it like it's basically sleeping
Alice:
[20:57] Um gosh I wish but I just felt really low and I went to acupuncture and I told the girl just really low and we did a few points um to help with sort of that energy alignment and you know uterus blood flow and all that jazz and I walked out and I was like it's like really low but I didn't really think anything of it I had a few kind of weird pressures I guess you could call them they weren't painful it was just like oh this is a bit different than what it felt like the past 37 weeks 37 plus two I woke up it's actually a funny story because I wasn't expecting to give birth this early but I woke up and I remember saying to my partner TJ I was like I think I've weighed myself um you know I'm a bit weird so he was like babe that's so not like that's not normal I was like oh like maybe my pelvic floor is just super weak I guess he's getting heavier maybe that's just what happens at 13 weeks kind of oblivious to the fact that it was actually my waters breaking. You see in movies, right, that it was gash of water.
Alice:
[21:56] I had a feeling that it wasn't always the case, this gash of water. And I think maybe it was through the podcast I learned that or something else, but it felt like a really anticlimactic water breaking. So I didn't think anything of it, but I remember maybe half an hour to an hour later, I was still weeing myself. I was like, okay, this is definitely like my bladder is definitely not is there's something up here. So I went to the supermarket, walked to the supermarket and got some like pads and stuff. I don't know what this is, but it is something that might need some, I guess, observation. So that's why I got the pads just in case I needed to observe if it was any sort of blood or anything, you know.
Alice:
[22:34] By this time, I went to the toilet and I saw my mucus plug in the toilet.
Mel:
[22:40] All right, let's take a second to talk about mucus plugs. For new players at home, if you don't realize that there might be a mucus plug in there, let me tell you. Your uterus, where your baby's living, is closed off by your cervix, which holds your uterus shut all the way through your pregnancy. And it's held shut by two muscles, one on the inside, one on the outside. And it creates this tube and inside the tube of your cervix is mucus it's called a mucus plug or you know women sometimes say they've had a show and the show is the mucus plug coming away and coming out of your cervix this can happen towards the end of your pregnancy as your cervix starts to open shorten and dilate towards the end of pregnancy but there's no correlation between having a show or seeing a mucus plug and when labor is actually going to start but often women will see these during labor as your cervix dilates the mucus plug has less to cling to and starts to come away sometimes though they don't come at all and you'll see the mucus plug just sitting on top of the baby's head as it's born and they can look different every woman's mucus plug looks different some of them are huge like i've seen a mucus plug was like the size of a golf ball before just sitting on a woman's pad and.
Mel:
[24:03] But they can be clear or a bit cloudy, white and cloudy. They can have streaks of blood in them. Some of them can be quite bloody where they look like a blood clot. We just call that a bloody show.
Mel:
[24:15] Sometimes it's just streaks of blood. Or they could look a brownie colour if it's old blood that's been sitting in there for a while. And the mucus blood can regenerate. So sometimes if you lose a bit of mucus blood, it just keeps coming through your pregnancy. That's because it can regenerate. Sometimes it'll come out in bits and pieces. Sometimes it's a huge, huge big glob. But that's what a show is. That's what Alice is talking about here. So don't be surprised if you see that. That's the mucus plug that just lives in your cervix, and it'll start to come away as your cervix dilates and opens.
Alice:
[24:49] And so that's when I started to feel like something was maybe a little bit different. I ended up calling my midwife at about 8.30, and she knows I'm a bit blase about it all. And I was like, oh, Linda, like, hey, I don't know what's going on, but I keep weighing myself. Linda's amazing. She's very – she never pushes anything on you. She never sort of plants any seeds in a really good way because I think, you know, if someone says, oh, you're in labor, then like all of a sudden you're like, oh, my gosh, bye. So she kind of said like, oh, looks like he might, you know, he's doing something, like my baby. And I was like, oh, yeah, like, yeah, yeah, okay. I kind of had a feeling. I was like, maybe that means that I'm in labor. But she never said the word, which I think was really good because I pretty much for the two hours after that, I gaslighted myself that I wasn't in labor and I was just, I don't know, myself or whatever.
Mel:
[25:43] I love this strategy of denying that you're in labor for as long as possible. So in early labor, you can start to get these contractions and you're, Maybe you think to yourself, okay, great, I'm in labor. You make all the plans. You find childcare. You kind of go into the labor rhythm. Can I encourage you, if you do start to get contraction, I love this strategy of just denying that you're in labor for as long as possible. Alice calls it gaslighting yourself. No, no, not really in labor. Not really in labor. I think labor is as much a physical game as it is a mental game. And if you're telling yourself you know no it's probably not time yet no it's probably not time yet and you can go about your day look I personally think it sets you up for a more positive early labor experience rather than going great I'm in labor I'm expecting it to progress why isn't it progressing so going about your day until you can no longer continue to go about your day.
Mel:
[26:49] Deny these early contractions as long as you can until you can no longer deny them because they will become a time in your labor where you think no I can no longer deny this I'm clearly in labor these contractions are taking my attention I have to stop I have to breathe I have to change position I can't concentrate on the things that are going on around me and it seems as though this strategy worked for Alice and it's certainly something that I recommend to my clients so you know keep that in mind for a strategy that could help you in the early labor phase to just set your expectations appropriately so.
Alice:
[27:28] I ended up just going by my day and I think if I learned anything from this sort of this sort of free labor labor was it was actually really good to gaslight myself like to pretend that nothing was happening and I think It was because I basically just went on my day, did my things, chatted to my mates, went for a walk, like went to the beach, basically distracted myself to a point where I knew things were going on, but it wasn't a stressful thing. It wasn't like I had to kind of go and, you know, start putting my TENS machines on and start having a shower or whatever, or, you know, get stressed and start washing all these clothes or whatever. So it was really good. And I also think it meant that labor felt a bit quicker because I had two hours where I was like technically not in labor. So by about nine o'clock, I then started to get these contractions.
Alice:
[28:25] I was like, okay, it's coming every three minutes, five minutes. There's an element of rhythm to this. This is definitely not Braxton Hicks. This is, you know, Linda was right. Something's going on. now by this time with TJ and I was just friends we're like we're not prepared like I'm still I just went on maternity leave yesterday like I've got so much stuff to get done but I tried not to stress TJ was like babe you go into the other room you'd sort yourself like just do whatever you need to do be calm like go into your zone I'm gonna do everything so he kind of called his mom from Brisbane which is like an hour and a half he's like mom come down clean can you come clean And then TJ was like cleaning all Clyde's clothes that we hadn't cleaned
Alice:
[29:08] yet. I just went into my zone. So I put on my music. I created like a bit of a birth playlist before I was in labor. Thank goodness. Thank goodness that was the one thing I was organized about. It was music that made me feel really centered and empowered. It wasn't like beats or anything. It was very feminine. I don't know how to explain it. It's kind of like.
Mel:
[29:31] A bit sort of meditative. Yeah.
Alice:
[29:34] But yeah, I don't know. I can share it in the show notes if you want, but it's a really, a lot of people ask me for the playlist because it was on the YouTube episode that I did, but it was a beautiful playlist and it really centered me and, essentially from about nine to ten that was when I was like okay I need like I'm in labor I've accepted this like this isn't just hanging out you know wearing myself I'm in labor and I'm going to sort of start you know getting ready and preparing and in that hour I used lots of natural pain management tools so the TENS machine was really really useful the combs which I'll go into a little bit later were really useful. I went into the shower for a little bit as well and basically just stuck on my hands and knees for the whole time. Like the thought of sitting up or on my back was repulsive, to be honest. So yeah, I spent that hour just like centering myself and doing all those things and going back and forth. Something actually I learned on the Great Thrift of Browning, I think was about breathing techniques. Something that I did during that time and then I I guess, later on too was lots of those sort of really rhythmic and like deep belly breaths. But, you know, not in a way where I didn't teach myself how to breathe. I didn't do any courses or anything.
Alice:
[30:56] I think for me it just felt instinctual. It wasn't something that I had to kind of practice every day and be like, all right, three breaths in, two breaths out. Like it wasn't nothing. And I think that's something that, you know, could be useful for listeners is like it can actually be quite instinctual if you let your body do the thing and if you think about it deep belly breaths long breath out like it feels right so doing what feels right rather than doing what you know the courses tell you to do yeah
Mel:
[31:25] Because we had that episode with emma johnston.
Alice:
[31:28] Yeah that's right and
Mel:
[31:30] She just talked a lot about you know just bigger than normal breath for relaxation and labor can be a time of unusual stress like if you're doing it for the first time even if you're not frightened and just reminding yourself like bigger than normal breath.
Alice:
[31:47] That's yeah that's so true yeah that it's so simple right it was cool so that was like that one hour period and mind you I was expecting to like have that one hour period over like six hours so like I was like all right I'm in this for the long run guys but let's get comfortable between 10 and 9 and 10 my contractions basically went from 20 seconds to a minute a minute and a half, and they were a minute in gap. So I was having three or four contractions within 10 minutes, and Linda told me, like, give me a buzz when that happens. And what if I'm in it later? I'm like, babe, I think we have to get the bath ready in my best because this baby's coming out way quicker. Yeah, I basically jumped in the car. I had my clary sage in one hand, my comb in the other, my TENS machine on my back, my beautiful music in the car, and TJ, my partner, was driving like 20 kilometers an hour because the birth centre we went to was like up in the valley on a mountain, so it was at the best of roads, I will say that, and it was possibly the most uncomfortable part of the birth was in the car. how
Mel:
[32:55] Far was it how long did you have to travel it was.
Alice:
[32:58] So 25 minutes on a good day 40 minutes when you give it back yeah 20 it's
Mel:
[33:04] A long time isn't it.
Alice:
[33:05] It was but you know what I don't know if this is an unhealthy way of of coping with labor but I I actually feel I've had dissociated for that period of time because I was like this is really painful but I'm I'm gonna just like get out of my body it was actually really helpful yes it was painful but it was like Like I just knew that, you know, if it's 40 minutes, that means I've got maybe like, you know, 10 contractions or whatever. And so like I'm just going to let that happen. I'm going to breathe my clarity stage. I'm just going to be on another planet. It really helped. And then we got there and I was like, oh, what up here?
Mel:
[33:41] What is this birth centre that's like in the valley?
Alice:
[33:45] It sounds really remote. It's not really, but it's Mewidlin Bar in Northern Rivers. So it's, you know, Byron Bay. It's kind of like inland from Byron up north a little bit more. So we're coming from kind of Kingscliff area and we had to sort of go inland and up and then down and around and all this stuff. So, yeah, it wasn't.
Mel:
[34:08] Is it part of the hospital service?
Alice:
[34:12] Yeah. So it's part of the hospital, the Wimbledon Bar Hospital, but it's not really. Like I'd never been to the hospital. I'd only ever been to the birth centre. It's beautiful. Like, highly recommend it if anyone's in the area of Northern Rivers. But, yeah, so, yeah, we got there. And by this point, I was kind of in my own world. Like I remember meeting my widow out the front and I was like, this is so random. But like, I don't know, I just felt really weird. It's like I've been dropped off at school. Like if this is like a weird thing, I'm giving birth and I'm just like dropped off at school. And I'm going up to my classroom. Maybe I was just in a weird zone and I thought
Alice:
[34:50] That was just like the funniest thing ever. But we had got up to the birth center and something that I really really appreciate is when I had my midwife appointment so every one month or two weeks or however long everyone I had was in the birth room that I was going to give birth up I know that's not always possible but that was sort of a really intentional thing that the midwives did so when I went to the birth center and when I went to the birth room it was so familiar to me it was like kind of a home birth but with a little bit of kind of intervention I guess you could say or sort of like the cross between a hospital birth and a home birth so I knew what the bath looked like I knew what the bed looked like I knew what things were around rather than just going to a hospital and and being like okay you're in room 16 see you later so we turned up and god bless Linda she'd had the bath running the essential oil diffuser on so I let her know all those things prior so in my birth uh I guess like intentions I wrote down like what would have what would be great if we do have options for that uh so the bath um the diffuser and we had the music play and things like that so that was awesome I got there and something that was in my birth intentions is like if you don't need to cervical checks can kind of pass I don't really need them something that I learned through actually the great birth rebellion podcast was that but yeah about like whether you need it, whether you don't,
Alice:
[36:20] Whether it's even important,
Alice:
[36:22] Whether it actually tells a story or we didn't check to see how dilated I was. To be honest, I feel like things were progressing so quickly that it wasn't necessary at all. But yeah, I got there and I went straight into the bath. I felt like I needed to get in there.
Alice:
[36:38] Basically from 11 till 12, labored in the bath, had the music playing the bath was such a saving grace I don't know if I would ever have a birth without a bath if possible just because it didn't take the pain away I don't think anything does unless you get
Alice:
[36:57] Something but from a natural pain management point of view I don't think the aim of the pain management is to take the pain away to be able to manage it right so yeah I got in the bath and I I was like, this is manageable. My combs, which basically, from what I was aware, the combs kind of divert your pain receptors. So I had bruises on my hands. I was like, these combs, I swear, changed my life. But they were really good. So I had them in my hands the whole labour from when I was at the birth centre. And yeah, I was in the back all fours for that entire hour. I really think that understanding how labour worked was really, really important in that time in particular, because there was one moment there where I said to my partner, I was like, I actually don't think I can do this anymore. And I remember thinking back maybe it was an episode where I was like wait that's really good because it means that I'm nearly there and I know that's maybe a messed up way of thinking but I remember thinking okay probably transition we're getting close this is a really good thing to think yeah
Mel:
[38:14] Yeah that's exactly right I even I said I was already midwife when I had my babies I was like oh my gosh it's so hard wait wait like as i was saying it i'm like we know what's going on you are getting to the end because you feel like you can't go on and you're like that's because you 100.
Alice:
[38:31] Right and i think that's where that education comes in it's like if i had no idea i would literally think this is when i need the epidural like i i can't do this for more than a few more hours and it's like i i wouldn't have had to because i knew that my body was was going to finish soon or I was going to have the baby soon. So that was really, really cool. That was really cool. And then there was a time where I noticed this was about 11.30. I noticed my body pushing. And mind you, I hadn't really...
Alice:
[39:05] Done any like pushing this or anything like that that was not even a part of my birth preparation I didn't even know if it is um necessary but I hadn't I didn't know how to push basically but my body did it and I learned through my preparation through surrendering and all that that it actually is quite likely your body does push when you don't have your drugs involved and so when I felt that intense urge to push I knew that it was it was right like I didn't I wasn't scared of it whereas I felt like if I hadn't educated myself on that, you know, that feel, ejection reflex or that pushing, I think I would have stopped. I don't want to be like, oh my gosh, what's going on? Like my body's going, you know, it's got a mind of its own, which it does, but that's good. Essentially like push for 20 minutes and then the classic kind of ring of fire, all that happened. And I kind of had this feeling to sort of slow down and it wasn't like a conscious thing, like a thing I thought and I think a lot of this labour wasn't a conscious thing. It wasn't like, all right, now, step two, pause and like there wasn't any of that. It was like this trust in my body that I could do that, I could trust it. I kind of pushed for a little bit, stopped. The bath was definitely helpful in that and Tide was born at sort of 12.30. So, yeah, just an hour and a half after getting into the birth centre.
Mel:
[40:33] Yes, it was like 7.30 in the morning when you, you know, we in hindsight realised your waters had broken.
Alice:
[40:39] Yeah, yeah. So they labelled it as a three-hour labour and 26 minutes of pushing. So the early labour was that sort of 7.30 and then it kind of really by the time it actually started getting in those regular contractions, that's when they sort of started. it but yeah mostly the whole this
Mel:
[40:58] Is quite a rapid first birth.
Alice:
[41:00] Yeah yeah yeah i was told in hindsight it was it definitely went for zero to 100 but that's very alice hooded let's talk about this but you know what was fascinating is so i didn't thankfully i didn't have any tears or anything like they said to me they're like you don't even look like you've given birth like when they were like assessing and i was like look sorry i don't i i don't know what i did but i honestly think um in hindsight like really looking at it there's a couple of reasons why I might not have said and one of them I think I put down to the bar because it was so warm and comforting and I felt relaxed but then also sort of that that slow breathing in that that latter part of that sort of transition period where I didn't push like I wasn't it wasn't an effort it was like my body was doing it and I think trusting that was was really necessary and I didn't even mention this I did some perineal stretching before I gave birth for a few weeks too. So probably a plethora of things that help with that non-terring.
Mel:
[42:03] Yeah, I mean, you're right. So already you were also in a comfortable space, not on your back. So in the birth pool is its own position. Even if you're reclining back, you're not on your back in a birth pool.
Alice:
[42:16] Yeah.
Mel:
[42:17] Nobody telling you to push when you didn't feel ready.
Alice:
[42:20] Yeah.
Mel:
[42:21] And it sounds like there was a real intentionality to just surrender to whatever your body was going to do. So there's kind of not this internal mental battle with you. And wait you know waiting for your body to take over like that your body's ready your body's saying i'm ready now to push the baby out rather than trying to get the baby out sooner than that you know it's yeah yeah the whole combination of things and the parenting message being cared by a mid cared for by a midwife you know good nutrition in your brain it's all part of it.
Alice:
[42:53] So yeah yeah it's like a puzzle isn't it yeah i didn't even mention this actually with the midwife the midwives didn't really intervene in a really good way like they did so much but they did so little at the same time in in the sense of you know they didn't tell me stop pushing start pushing it like they didn't say anything in the best way possible so I think that that was really helpful too in that pushing phase they just trusted me and that made me trust myself and my partner as well trust me So it was this, yeah, symbiotic relationship we had without even establishing one formally. So it was really positive.
Mel:
[43:36] You talked about your placental birth that wives felt maybe there was a bit more blood than they were comfortable with. Yeah.
Alice:
[43:44] Long story short, so I gave birth and the water started to darken as it does because, you know, you bleed a little bit. They were mentioning because my blood pressure was a little bit low, in that labor period. I was actually really sick giving birth, which didn't help them with the breathing. But anyway, my blood pressure was low as a result. So I was losing a little bit of blood and the midwife, they actually talked to TJ. So I had no idea what was going on. And they were like, so I was losing a little bit of blood. We're actually, it's darkening like more than we would like. So we're thinking about getting her out.
Mel:
[44:23] And they're like.
Alice:
[44:23] Do you reckon that's okay? and he was like yeah just talk to her that's fine which i think was really nice actually for them to go to tj first they know how much trust i have in tj because tj was is is quite in tune with how i feel a lot of the time so he may have been like no she's doesn't want you to talk about that or like yes get her out or whatever so yeah they they went up to me now like you know you're losing a little bit of blood you don't have to but we would like if we could get you out so we can assess or or manage or at least look at how much blood you're losing because basically when you're in a bath right like you you can't really assess how much blood you're losing because it's diluted with water so um i was actually fine with that like i didn't really have any um concerns like i was so stoked i was like i just had a baby that's fine as long as i can hold him still and as long as i can have that sort of physiological placental burn it's okay with it's not the end of the world Now,
Mel:
[45:18] What Alice is talking about here with physiological placental birth is about the technique that she decided to use to give birth to her placenta. And we've got a whole Great Birth Rebellion podcast episode on different types of placental birth techniques, if you want to call it that, different ways to give birth to your placenta. And I've linked that in the show notes below for you so you can have a listen to that if you want to learn about placental birth. But for you playing at home again if you're new to the game once you give birth to your baby, you are going to have to give birth to the placenta it's in there it'll stay attached to your uterus for a short time after the baby's born but then it needs to detach come away and come out and giving birth to your placenta just like giving birth to your baby where there's a labor process and a birth process there is also a labor and birth process to your placenta you're not finished yet after you have your baby and Alice chose to have a physiological third stage physiological placental birth and what that means is that just like we wait for the baby to come and let the baby emerge under the woman's own power same thing with the placenta you go through the labor process of placental birth and then give birth to your placenta without medication without to any medical interventions.
Mel:
[46:39] That's a less common way of giving birth, but certainly it's the way that we prioritize it in low intervention settings, like where Alice gave birth. You know, it's something that I practice as a home birth midwife the majority of the time.
Mel:
[46:54] However, if you're giving birth in hospital and you want to have a physiological placental birth, you are going to have to ask for that and potentially advocate for that because it's a less common way of giving birth to your placenta in hospital. In hospitals they'll often prioritize what we call active management of the placenta and what that means is that you'll be given an injection of artificial oxytocin depending on where you live it's sometimes called syntocinon or pitocin and you'll be given an injection of that and then they'll wait for signs that placenta is detaching so sometimes there can be a gush of blood and the cord lengthens as the placenta detaches and they'll wait for that then they'll put their hand on your tummy and another on the cord and apply traction and pull on the cord to bring out your placenta. With actively managed placental birth, you have to participate a lot less. Women aren't necessarily as involved in the placental birth as with physiological placental birth. However, and you'll hear in the other podcast episode about placental birth, one that's linked in the show notes, is that you can layer some of the elements of physiological placental birth with active management and still get good outcomes.
Mel:
[48:09] So what Alice is talking about here is physiological placental birth, but this might not necessarily be your experience. If you're in a birth location that favors active management, they also may not tell you that they're going to do active management and just assume that you understand.
Mel:
[48:26] Sometimes I'll say to you, hey, do you mind if we give you this injection? Sometimes I just tell you they are giving you the injection and you don't even have time to object or to discuss it. If you do want to have a physiological placental birth, it's important to discuss this earlier before you get to the point of actually giving birth to the placenta because it does take some negotiating sometimes with your care provider if that's not their usual practice.
Alice:
[48:55] They got me out of the bath and popped me on the bed and that was all fine. They still had the music playing, lights dimmed, all of that. It was fascinating because I'd been in the bath the whole labour basically. Getting out and going on my back was a really uncomfortable position really uncomfortable and
Alice:
[49:15] I maybe naively so didn't realize actually how painful sometimes placental but it was it was it was really weird like I had to kind of push this placenter out I just thought it was like slip out like surely I just gave birth to a baby like surely the placenta is all that hot right but because I'd been on my back and the whole labor I'd been this fast on my old boards it was just this really interesting contrast, sorry, between positions. So yeah, I did, I said to my midwife, actually like 20 minutes in to the third stage of placenta birth, I said, Linda, can you just pull it out? Like, I was like getting angry because it was like really annoying me that I just wanted to be with my baby and not have to deal with the placenta. Long story short, she ended up kind of like looking and seeing if it had detached which it had but there was not too much blood loss so she kind of just said push this out like it was going to come out with the next contraction so pushed it out and it was just like you know as it as it does and then the contractions pretty much stopped after that so It was a fascinating situation, but, you know, I'm not sad about it. It was just the way it goes, and I would rather have a conservative approach with blood loss postpartum than, you know, stick with a bath and, you know, something that's happening.
Mel:
[50:32] It actually sounds like such a typical placental birth story. Yeah. It's like a whole other thing to do, and it does require effort. You know, it's this little moment where you have to still give the placental birth some attention.
Alice:
[50:46] Yeah, you have to do it. You have to do it. And, you know, I think it's not a painful thing. I don't want to scare people. Be like, oh, my gosh, it's as painful as labor or whatever. But it just, it's really annoying. It's an annoying thing that you have to do. You know what I mean? Like study for exams. Like you have to study.
Alice:
[51:02] But you just do it, you know?
Mel:
[51:04] I wish I didn't feel this way about placentas because I'm like. Yeah.
Alice:
[51:07] They're so amazing.
Mel:
[51:09] They're amazing. But I'm like, oh, I don't like this part. We have to all concentrate on the placenta. And, you know, that is the part. Once your baby comes out and you're waiting for placenta, that's where the midwives are on, you know, they're hyperventilating about keeping an eye on your blood loss, as they were, and you're right, in a pool, you can vaguely estimate blood loss, but you can't see how fast it's coming out or anything like that. So it makes sense to have gotten out.
Alice:
[51:35] Yeah, absolutely. I'm no shade on that situation at all. I think I passed the placenta within like half an hour, which is sort of a normal amount of time, And then, yeah, Teej and I basically had sort of an hour or two hours. I actually don't even remember. I think it was an hour and a half, two hours, where we just had our own space and the midwives just kind of left the room. Thankfully, like I was happy with that. They didn't just leave us to attend for ourselves. But they knew that that was part of my birth intentions was to have that time. And, yeah, then basically like I had a shower and we left the birth. And I think it was two and a half hours. After we gave birth so we were home by like five o'clock had dinner I was like this is so incredibly amazing but so random just
Mel:
[52:26] Like a regular work day you know.
Alice:
[52:28] Actually what and literally my midwife said she's like I'm going to yoga tonight I'm like you do you boo like you go to yoga I'm just gonna go home like with my child yeah and then we just yeah we just had dinner and went to bed it was just the most peculiar thing but it was amazing it
Mel:
[52:44] Just totally flips the script on what women are told about birth. It sounds like you just really honed in on a great model of care, that you had care providers who were completely aligned with your intentions, that you were informed enough to make decisions that felt right to you, that you weren't frightened to the point where you could submit and surrender to your body. You did all that, made really a lot of preparations, A lot of your preparations in your pregnancy, I think, set you up for this experience. So, you know, I think it's hats off as well. When women make choices, controllable factors that make a big difference to the outcome, even that you didn't have any vaginal exams, you know, these kinds of things aren't always possible, even for low risk women in hospitals, it becomes a battle. And so it sounds like you chose the things that really set you up for this experience. So, like, first, kudos for all that.
Alice:
[53:45] Thank you. I appreciate that.
Mel:
[53:47] There's a lot of controllable factors that we can apply that just increase your chances of this kind of experience.
Mel:
[53:55] We just mentioned here that there are things that you can do and decisions that you can make that will affect your birth experience.
Mel:
[54:05] There are ways that you can curate a great birth for yourself or really at least improve the chances of you having a great birth. There are some basic strategies that once you know about them, you can implement them for yourself. There's no time to go through each of them today here in this episode. And that's why I want to invite you to my free masterclass where I share what I know about how to curate a great birth experience. This is actually the first real-time event that I've ever won for women and their partners and I'm inviting you now to join me live online on June 27th 2025 for a free two-hour get-together with me where I share my tips for planning a great birth the link to register is in the show notes and if you're listening to this as part of a back catalogue and you're thinking oh no it's beyond June 27th don't worry the session will be recorded and it's available to listen online after the date so you can still go to melanethemidwife.com to watch the full masterclass for free but the advantage of joining live with me is that we can interact in real time and there will be a time and space for questions in this live online version.
Mel:
[55:25] I've never made myself available like this before. There are over 50,000 people who listen to this podcast every week. So register for the live event online now. The link is in the show notes. I'm keen to show you how to curate a great birth for yourself in this free live masterclass. Again, if it's after the date, you can still go to melaniethemidwife.com and see the recording of the masterclass. But if in any way you can make it live we will get to interact you can ask your questions if you are coming live or if you register for the live event and you can't be there don't worry after the event i will automatically send you a recording of the master class and you can always have that there as a resource i will see you there the link is in the show notes.
Alice:
[56:15] Yeah and that's right it increases your chances it doesn't mean that you know you do this and you have the birth that I have or anything like that it's just you know what you can control and what you're willing to control and and doing that and then letting the other things that you can't control be the other thing I think is really important to mention is when I was looking into ways that I want to birth I also considered other options that might happen too so for example like if I were to have a c-section for whatever reason what that would look like and why that would happen if I need to, or if I needed to have an induction, what that would look like and why would I need to? I don't want to prepare for a C-section, but I'm going to educate myself about it in case it happens so I have that peace of mind.
Alice:
[57:02] And also, what can I choose in that situation that I can still have control over? Can I do skin to skin? Can I do an hour of the golden hour? Can I get teach you how to cut the core can I do delayed core cramping what part of the things that I can't control and can control in these situations and I think that's really important because I know that it might feel like you're considering a c-section if you're looking into it it's like no no no like you don't have to do that it can just say that's an option that's a possibility if that comes to it because sometimes you have to we're so lucky we have the medical the medical repertoire to be able to do those things if they need to happen but it's not like you're you know you're falling victim to you know the medicalization spectrum if you do even think about as a potential outcome well
Mel:
[57:51] That's right and so many of my clients are like I don't even want to think about it it's not going to happen if I think about it and it's almost like you're manifesting it yes way.
Alice:
[57:59] Yeah and
Mel:
[57:59] I'm like yeah this is you being yeah prepared for every scenario, Because if you are, if we do end up in a scenario where you need a cesarean section or you need to consider an episiotomy or vacuum or closet and you know nothing about them, then you know nothing about all of your options. And actually there are choices and opportunities within those things that you can control. So I love that you mentioned that because it is important to prepare for all possibilities so that you go, okay, that's all right. We're reverting to the cesarean plan. And I still have control over sort of 50% of the things that are going to happen.
Alice:
[58:38] Yeah.
Mel:
[58:39] And that makes the experience a lot less disappointing.
Alice:
[58:43] Intimidating and scary and, yeah, and disappointing, right? Because it doesn't feel like it's been taken away from you and, like, forced on you. It's like, no, okay, this is a situation that's come about. Not my fault, but what part of it can I control? What part of it can I have say in? I know that the Great Birth of Rebellion has talked a lot about this, about coercive control and ethics and how we have informed consent. There are so many things you can do as females and as partners in the birth space that we don't think we can do. And we can do so much. We can have so much say in what we are willing to accept and not accept. But without knowing what you can and can't, then how are we going to ever say what we feel like we want? You know, so I think it's really, really important to understand where your responsibility lies in all outcomes rather than just your nice little ideal outcome over here.
Mel:
[59:41] Yeah. And then if you're unprepared for the other scenarios, then you get more swept up in it, in a stressful situation that you don't want to be in. And then all of a sudden you have no idea what your options are.
Alice:
[59:54] Yeah.
Mel:
[59:55] I'm so glad you mentioned that, even though your scenario played out the way you had hoped that you were still prepared for all the other scenarios that could have unfolded.
Alice:
[1:00:04] For sure. Yeah, yeah. And my midwife was open with that too. She was like, this is, you know, we don't want a C-section, but if you do, like, you know, unfortunately with the birth scenario, you can't give C-sections there. Like, that's not possible. So I had to go to a tweet. So that's, you know, we had to talk about that because, you know, I don't want to be, you know in the depths of labor and then I have to have a c-section go on ambulance for half an hour like that'll be traumatic but if I knew beforehand that that was the situation I'd have to go into then I feel like that would be far less from me is
Mel:
[1:00:35] There anything that you know if you get pregnant again and you get to plan another birth is there anything you think you would do differently from this time but you.
Alice:
[1:00:45] Know what I don't want to sound like a little bit loser but I actually don't think I would change anything. Come on with me. No, like, I honestly, yeah, I truly don't think I would change anything. Like, I had... The most ideal but and to be honest better than I would have imagined because it was three hours not you know 20 but yeah I actually wouldn't change anything like even the whole midwife midwifery group practice all of that like that was beautiful and the aftercare and all of that that was involved was amazing to be honest if I really like if I'm trying to be really critical it would be maybe I would get a lactation consultant in the first few days after birth because there has been some latching issues that we've been struggling with but like that's not really related to birth but like apart from that yeah I don't I don't think I would I would change much yeah
Mel:
[1:01:41] Oh if only that's my wish for the whole world that if you asked a woman.
Alice:
[1:01:46] Like is
Mel:
[1:01:47] There anything that you would change that they go do you know what absolutely not I would repeat that all over again that is just magic and and I guess the reason I am so pleased that you decided to share your birth story on the great birth rebellion that it really shows women that this is possible it's not some weird fantasy that we write about in books or that I sit here and spout on about it's real women having really fulfilling births that they would willingly repeat but I do you think it takes conscious effort.
Alice:
[1:02:22] Yeah I'm gonna say that I had had a few people being like you're just lucky look I think there's an element of luck that's involved with this like absolutely there's no denying it and some people do get unlucky but I have been very conscious in my preparation you know and educating myself and knowing what I want and preparing my body you going to acupuncture doing sort of my pelvic floor exercises doing my perineal stretching having a great support partner making sure that my midwife and I are aligned like there are a lot of things that I consciously did to prepare for labor and during birth as well that weren't luck so yeah I think that's a really good thing that people can learn is like you have so much at your fingertips that you can you can take advantage of but you need to take advantage of it you can't and just go, I really want a good birth, and not know what that birth looks like.
Mel:
[1:03:15] Totally. You know, you've been doing that. You owned the fact, I'm pregnant. I'm going to need to put some effort into this. Not dissimilar to like, hey, I love my partner and we want to get married. It's like you don't just show up to a wedding venue and go, what are you going to give me? Throw me a wedding. You go there and you make a plan and you tell them what you want and you're like, this would be ideal. And they're like, well, here's our three options. You want to choose one of those. Women do, unfortunately or not, women do have to take responsibility over the things that they can control. And there are things that are out of control. So the fact that you even had access to a midwifery care program and a birth center were fortunate. There's women who don't have that, but then we can also still try and make the best out of really crappy situations. Some women are like, there's only a hospital near me. Maybe you could take a doula with you or maybe you could spend longer at home and not go there at the last minute. So we still have to make the most out of the scenarios that are presented to us. And some people are like, oh, we shouldn't have to. I'm like, yeah, but we do though because the system is not always on our side.
Alice:
[1:04:29] No, no. And, like, the unfortunate fact is that, like, you know, we shouldn't have to, but we do. It's not your fault but it's your responsibility. And we are, as women, responsible for how we prepare for labour. Like, no one's going to do it for us, unfortunately. But let's split that narrative and go, okay, we are responsible for how we do labour. Like, that's amazing. We've got so much, like, responsibility. Like, this is all in, like, our power. Yeah, and let's use our power for that and for that benefit rather than being like,
Mel:
[1:05:02] I don't know, I have to do labour. Yeah, you swept up in it. There are so many powerful factors. You don't have to just go with the flow and accept whatever happens. You're like, actually, I have the power, responsibility, the privilege, the ability to control parts of my journey.
Alice:
[1:05:21] Yeah I think yeah I
Mel:
[1:05:23] Think your story.
Alice:
[1:05:24] Yeah yeah and I want to say as well like something that really motivated me to educate myself and to look into things is it wasn't me as such it was for my baby and my partner and I say that because I know a positive birth experience can result in a positive postpartum experience and for me I'm And like, look, if I can do anything for my baby and for my partner, it's to be in a good space postpartum. What can I do for that? Okay, well, I can't necessarily control what my baby's, you know, personality is like or temperament. I can't control a lot of things, you know, when it comes to that. But I can control my birth experience to an extent. So, like, if that's what I can do, like, I'm going to do it. You know, why not? And make it a little thing that's interesting. Make it a hobby. Look into it. Like get excited about it if you feel like you can. Make it something that, you know, you go into it and be like, I've done everything I can. You know, everything else is up to the universe to take hold of. But yeah, it was a motivation for me is how I feel post-partum.
Mel:
[1:06:32] Yeah, amazing. And that's, I mean, that's an investment in yourself. By true. And I mean, it's a little bit like preparing for a marathon. If someone said, right, in approximately 35 weeks, you are going to run a marathon. It's, you know, it's going to be tricky, but you can do it. You need to gather a team, a crew, prepare your body, you know, make a plan. How are you going to tackle this thing? You know, it's not similar. You're just, you're preparing for an event that's going to run.
Alice:
[1:07:03] And the thing is like so many people have run this marathon before you like you're not special like you they're sorry like there's so many other people who have done this and so many people who have been successful in running this marathon you can do it because like look at the evidence you know we've been doing this since the dawn of time so like if there's any sort of you know motivator look at this like everyone's everyone before you is better you're born this you know so yes find your thing Amazing.
Mel:
[1:07:33] I'm so grateful that you decided to come and tell your story on our podcast.
Alice:
[1:07:36] Oh, thanks. Thanks for listening. And honestly, yeah, I hope someone got something out of this and feels like they can have a little bit more say in their labour or birth preparation because it is so, so empowering when you, you know, when you have the labour, not necessarily of a dream, but the labour that you prepared for, at least like elements of it. And we all deserve that.
Mel:
[1:07:59] Another take-home message is just prepare for every possibility and you're ready. You're ready for a long labour. You're ready for a complex labour. You're ready for a quick one. You know, you're just ready. Thanks for being here, Alice.
Alice:
[1:08:13] My pleasure. Awesome. Yay.
Mel:
[1:08:16] To get access to the resources for each podcast episode, join the mailing list at melaniethemidwife.com. And to support the work of this podcast, wear the rebellion in the form of clothing and other merch at thegreatbirthrebellion.com follow me mel @melaniethemidwife on socials and the show @thegreatbirthrebellion all the details are in the show notes.
This transcript was produced by ai technology and may contain errors.
©2025 Melanie The Midwife
